{"corpus":"steiner","locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p013","lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"text":"In the evolution of the spiritual world the reverse is the case. There, that which exists and makes an impression, such as a physical object, is for the man in the spiritual world something inimical, something disturbing, something of which he knows that it pertains to the ‘nothingness,’ and that it is destined to disappear into nothing. And if one enters without further ado into a spiritual region in which there are perhaps rather undeveloped souls (souls who to the spiritual world are just as simple as many souls appear to be in the earthly world), then one finds the opposite opinion prevailing even there. Anything to which these dead souls attach value should not exist, as one speaks of existence here on the earth. Existence here, as such, is of no value to these souls. In the spiritual life it really is the case that one confronts pure spiritual beings. They affect one. But one must first acquire perception for them. It is thus: one stands in the spiritual world; behind one stand souls belonging to the spiritual hierarchies, Angels, Archangels, and so on. One knows they are there. But if a man is to perceive them, he must first arouse them into that which one here calls ‘existence.’ That which in the spiritual world works on one, must be brought into an ‘Imagination.’ That which is ‘non-awakened being,’ to which man does nothing, which simply exists of itself, that is of no value in the spiritual world. Here man stands on the earth, and is surrounded by nature. But the spiritual world demands that man should raise himself up to it, for it is not there without further ado. To have nature around one requires no special trouble. It exists, as it were, of itself. Therefore the materialistic love to have nature around them. But in the spiritual world nature is no longer there. For man, there only exists in the spiritual world that which he himself continuously works at. There he has to be continually active. That which is there, is the other world, that world which man has forsaken, to which he continually looks back, as though to a world of existence. The world, which carries the transitory within itself, continually battles with the non-existent. If for one moment the world so beloved by the materialists were to disappear, if men were to know nothing of their bodies, but first had to create the ‘imagination’ of them, if they were to know nothing of the table until they had created it for themselves in thought, but could instead see the spiritual world—then they would have in this life here below what they have there in the spiritual world. Those in the spiritual world can only bring it to perception by their own activity. The ‘other world’—our own world here below—is always present. Whereas here the heaven is hidden and only the world which is round us is always present, there the surrounding world is hidden unless we ourselves bring it into vision by our own efforts. For one who can have immediate cognisance of it, it is easy there to believe in the ‘world beyond,’ which is our present one. But consider from the standpoint of the spiritual that which makes this world of ours, I might almost say, disagreeable, is its permeation with existence. It is a disturbing fact that it is permeated with existence—that really is disturbing. Many say: ‘A spiritual world indeed!—I would willingly believe in one if I could only see it! If I could see it while here!’ We may compare that remark with what the souls in the spiritual world say: ‘We might endure that physical world continually existing down there if only it was not permanently present. If only it were not so permeated with being. We cannot look down on to the earth without seeing in every part of it this terrible existence.’","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"title":"3. The Subconscious Strata of the Soul-Life and the Life of the Spirit After Premature Death","site_heading":null,"date":"1915-11-20","location":null,"word_count":655,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p013","alignment_confidence":"low","alignment_reason":"count_diverges","two_voice_volume":false,"translation_credit":{"scope":"unit","status":"established","translator":"Henry Collison","identified_edition":"APC1927","book_title":"The Forming of Destiny and Life after Death","publisher":"Anthroposophical Publishing Co.","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA157a/English/APC1927/19151120p01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"edition_coverage":{"de":["original"],"en":["English"]},"available_versions":[{"lang":"de","edition":"original","edition_basis":null,"is_original":true,"is_default_edition":true,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p013"},{"lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p013","paragraph_aligned":true}],"record":{"record_type":"unknown","scope":"volume","note":"How this text was taken down (shorthand transcript, listeners' notes or manuscript) is not on record here. Unknown is not an assurance of a stenogram: check the edition's own notes before resting an argument on one word.","evidence":null,"evidence_translation":null,"evidence_source":null},"german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1915-11-20","de_passages":[{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p018","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p018"},{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p019","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p019"},{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p020","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p020"}],"bead_confidence":"high","pairing_state":"verified","verified":true,"evidence":["reader"],"reader_german":["GA 157a/1915-11-20/p018","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p019","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p020"],"length_check":{"de_words":643,"en_words":655,"ratio":1.02,"partial":false},"correspondence":"established","note":"English passage numbering is edition-relative, so the same number need not name the same paragraph in the German. The German original passage(s) above are the edition-invariant anchor — fetch them (lang='de') to verify wording before quoting across editions."},"paired_german":{"status":"paired","german":[{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p018","passage_number":18,"text":"In der Entwickelung der geistigen Welt ist das Umgekehrte der Fall. Dasjenige, was seiend ist, was einen Eindruck macht wie physische Gegenstände, das ist für den Menschen im Geistigen etwas Feindliches, etwas Störendes, etwas, wovon er weiß, daß es zum Nichtigen gehört, daß es verurteilt ist, in das Nichtige zu verschwinden. Und kommt man so ohne weiteres in ein geistiges Gebiet, wo nicht sehr weit entwickelte Seelen sind, Seelen, die also, ich möchte sagen, für den Geist noch ebenso naiv sind, wie viele Seelen für die Erde naiv sind, so findet man für die verstorbenen Seelen dort das entgegengesetzte Urteil. Etwas, worauf sie Wert legen, das darf nicht «sein», wie man hier auf der Erde von «sein» spricht. Dasjenige, was hier Sein ist, das ist nicht wertvoll für diese Seelen. Im geistigen Leben ist es ja so, daß man lauter geistigen Wesen gegenübersteht. Die wirken auf einen. Die muß man erst zur Anschauung bringen. Es ist da so: Man steht in der geistigen Welt; hinter einem stehen Seelen der geistigen Hierarchien, Angeloi, Archangeloi und so weiter. Man weiß, sie sind da. Aber wenn sie für einen da sein sollen, so muß man sie erst auferwecken zu dem, was man hier das Sein nennt. Das, was in der geistigen Welt auf einen wirkt, das muß man zur Imaginierung bringen. Was nichterwecktes Sein ist, wozu man nichts tut, was so knüppeldick einfach vorhanden ist, das ist dort nicht wertvolles Sein.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":238,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p018"},{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p019","passage_number":19,"text":"Hier auf der Erde steht man und ist umgeben von der Natur, und die geistige Welt, zu der muß man sich erheben, die ist nicht so ohne weiteres da. Es kostet keine besondere Mühe, die Natur um sich zu haben. Sie ergibt sich von selbst als ein Sein. Deshalb lieben es die Materialisten, die Natur um sich zu haben. Die ist aber nicht mehr da in der geistigen Welt. Es ist nichts da in der geistigen Welt, als was man sich immer erarbeitet. Da muß man immerfort tätig sein. Das, was da ist, das ist die andere Welt, die Welt, die man verlassen hat; auf die blickt man immer hin als auf eine seiende Welt: diese Welt, die das Vergängliche in sich trägt, die fortwährend kämpft mit dem Nichtigen.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":129,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p019"},{"locus":"GA 157a/1915-11-20/p020","passage_number":20,"text":"Wenn für einen Augenblick die Sache so wäre, daß die Welt, welche die Materialisten lieben, verschwinden würde, daß die Menschen nichts wissen würden von ihrem Leibe, daß sie sich die Imagination erst schaffen müßten, wenn sie nichts von dem Tisch wissen würden, bis sie ihn sich selbst denkend erschaffen würden, dafür aber die geistige Welt sehen würden, so hätten sie für das Leben hier, was sie dort haben in der geistigen Welt. In der geistigen Welt ist die Welt eben nur durch die eigene Tätigkeit zur Anschauung zu bringen. Die jenseitige Welt, also unser Diesseits, ist dort immer da. Während hier der Himmel verborgen ist und nur die Welt, die um uns ist, immer da ist, ist dort die Welt eigentlich verborgen, wenn man sie nicht tätig erst zur eigenen Anschauung bringt. Das Jenseits, unser Diesseits, das ist eine Welt, an die man nicht bloß glauben kann, sondern von der man wissen kann unmittelbar. Aber das, was diese unsere Welt hier, vom Gesichtspunkte der anderen Welt betrachtet, ich möchte sagen, fatal macht, das ist, daß sie mit dem Sein durchdrungen ist. Das stört, daß diese Welt mit dem Sein durchdrungen ist, wirklich, das stört. Wenn viele sagen: Ich wollte schon an eine geistige Welt glauben, wenn ich sie nur hier sehen könnte!, so kann man das vergleichen mit dem, was die Seelen in der geistigen Welt sagen: Ja, diese fortwährend da unten vorhandene physische Welt, man wollte sie schon ertragen, wenn sie nur nicht fortwährend «wäre», wenn sie nur nicht das Sein so aufdringlich in sich hätte. Man kann gar nicht hinunterschauen auf die Erde, ohne daß sie in allen ihren Punkten das furchtbare «Sein» hat.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":276,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/157a/1915-11-20/p020"}],"english":["GA 157a/1915-11-20/p013"],"method":"reader","confidence":"high","correspondence":"established","length_check":{"de_words":643,"en_words":655,"ratio":1.02,"partial":false},"pairing_state":"verified","verified":true,"evidence":["reader"],"reader_german":["GA 157a/1915-11-20/p018","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p019","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p020"]},"witness_completeness":{"ratio":1.04,"band":"comparable","note":null,"word_count":6993,"original_word_count":6738,"may_be_abridged":false},"witness_quality":{"translator":{"scope":"unit","status":"recorded","translator":"Henry Collison","identified_edition":"APC1927","book_title":"The Forming of Destiny and Life after Death","publisher":"Anthroposophical Publishing Co.","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA157a/English/APC1927/19151120p01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 157a/1915-11-20/p018","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p019","GA 157a/1915-11-20/p020"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"high","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. See witness_completeness for how much of the original this witness holds."}}