{"corpus":"steiner","locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p005-p007","extent":"range","passage_number":5,"through":7,"paragraph_count":3,"first_locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p005","last_locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p007","lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"title":"5. Atlantean Impulses in the Mexican Mysteries. The Problem of Natural Urges and Impulses, The Problem of Death","date":"1916-09-24","location":null,"alignment_confidence":"medium","alignment_reason":"beads:length","two_voice_volume":false,"translation_credit":{"scope":"unit","status":"established","translator":"Gilbert Church, Frédéric Kozlik and Stewart C. Easton","identified_edition":"AP1984","book_title":"Inner Impulses of Evolution","publisher":"Anthroposophic Press","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA171/English/AP1984/19160924p01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"edition_coverage":{"de":["original"],"en":["English"]},"record":{"record_type":"unknown","scope":"volume","note":"How this text was taken down (shorthand transcript, listeners' notes or manuscript) is not on record here. 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It has often been said that the thoughts, the perceptions, and also the social life of the Greeks become intelligible when we regard this fourth post-Atlantean culture—although Atlantean culture was, of course, much more elemental and instinctive. It assumed a more spiritual form in the culture of Greece and Rome. What had been direct experience in Atlantis was transposed into reality in Greece through fantasy, imagination and thoughts, and through the will, which, in turn, was inspired, by fantasy and imagination. We must realize that this Greco-Roman culture constituted a deep disillusionment for the luciferic and ahrimanic powers. The luciferic and ahrimanic powers of the hierarchy standing nearest to the human hierarchy, desired that the Atlantean culture, as it had been in Atlantis, should simply re-appear in the fourth post-Atlantean epoch. In other words it was the intention of the luciferic and ahrimanic powers that everything that had constituted the essential nature of Atlantean culture should be merely repeated during the Greco-Roman age. (You can read about this in *An Outline of Occult Science* or in the book, *Cosmic Memory*.)","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":214,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/171/1916-09-24/p005","german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1916-09-24","de_passages":[{"locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p005","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/171/1916-09-24/p005"}],"bead_confidence":"medium","length_check":{"de_words":396,"en_words":328,"ratio":0.83,"partial":false},"correspondence":"established","note":"English passage numbering is edition-relative, so the same number need not name the same paragraph in the German. 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Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 171/1916-09-24/p005"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"medium","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. See witness_completeness for how much of the original this witness holds."}},{"passage_number":6,"locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p006","text":"This plan was frustrated inasmuch as humanity was raised to a higher stage consistent with the post-Atlantean era. What was essentially new and great in Greek and Roman culture constituted a spiritual disillusionment for the luciferic and ahrimanic powers. Through their different influences these powers desired to educate the Greeks and so to develop their powers of fantasy that the souls of men would gradually have become weary of the earth, would lose their inclination to incarnate further on the earth, and would tend to withdraw, as souls, from the earth in order to found a realm and planet of their own. The effect of this influence was annulled through the leadership of those powers we call the normal hierarchies, whereby the quality of fantasy and imagination in the Greeks, which also influenced their social life, was transformed into joy in the earthly. The Greek received into his nature such a joy in the life of earth and of the senses that he had no desire to live merely in the world of imagination where his soul would be alienated from earthly existence, but inclined rather to the attitude expressed in the well known words, “Better to be a beggar on the earth, than a king in the realm of shades.” This joy in life between birth and death enabled the normal powers to avert from the Greeks the danger inherent in the plan of the luciferic powers, namely, to lead away the souls of men so that the bodies still to be born on the earth would have gone about without egos, and the souls would have departed to a special planet of their own.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":276,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/171/1916-09-24/p006","german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1916-09-24","de_passages":[],"bead_confidence":"medium","correspondence":"unestablished","note":"NOT ALIGNED. 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The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"not_checkable","note":"No verified paragraph alignment covers this passage, so its names cannot be compared with the German."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. See witness_completeness for how much of the original this witness holds."}},{"passage_number":7,"locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p007","text":"In Roman culture, on the other hand, Ahriman's aim was to help Luciferic by shaping the Roman Empire and what followed it in such a way that it would have become a great earthly mechanism for ego-less human beings. In this way he would have been of assistance to Lucifer. Whereas Lucifer's desire was to extract the juice of the lemons for himself, as it were, Ahriman, working in the Roman Empire, set out to thoroughly squeeze the lemons and to create an entirely mechanistic state organization. Thus do Ahriman and Lucifer play into each other's hands. The plan was frustrated by the development in a preeminently egoistic sense in the people of the Roman Empire of the concept of *Civis*, the citizen. Human egoism, be it remembered, can only develop in physical existence on the earth. Thereby Ahriman's plan to make men into ego-less beings was frustrated. It was precisely the bleakness, the lack of fantasy in Roman culture, the egoism in Roman politics and system of rights that thwarted Ahriman's plan.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":173,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/171/1916-09-24/p007","german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1916-09-24","de_passages":[{"locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p006","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/171/1916-09-24/p006"}],"bead_confidence":"medium","length_check":{"de_words":370,"en_words":360,"ratio":0.97,"partial":false},"correspondence":"established","note":"English passage numbering is edition-relative, so the same number need not name the same paragraph in the German. 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Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 171/1916-09-24/p006"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"medium","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. 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Das heißt, es sollte alles, was den atlantischen Zeitraum in seinem Wesen ausmacht - Sie können ja das in der «Geheimwissenschaft im Umriß» oder in dem kleinen Büchelchen «Unsere atlantischen Vorfahren» nachlesen -, alles, was das Wesentliche des atlantischen Zeitraums ausmacht, das sollte nach der Absicht der luziferischen und ahrimanischen Mächte während der griechischen und romanischen Zeit wiederholt werden. Diese Absicht wurde durchkreuzt, indem eben die Menschheit auf eine höhere, der nachatlantischen Zeit entsprechende Stufe gebracht worden ist. Das, was das Große, das bedeutungsvolle Neue gegenüber der Atlantis am Griechentum, am Römertum ist, das bildete für die luziferischen und ahrimanischen Mächte eine geistige Enttäuschung. Die luziferischen und ahrimanischen Mächte wollten in dem griechischen Volke durch ihre verschiedenen Einflüsse ein solches Volk erziehen, welches geneigt gewesen wäre, die Phantasiekräfte in der Seele so auszubilden, daß die Seelen allmählich erdenmüde geworden wären, daß die Seelen keine Neigung gehabt hätten, sich weiter lange auf der Erde zu inkarnieren, sondern gewissermaßen als Seelen von der Erde abzuziehen und ein eigenes Reich, einen eigenen Planeten zu begründen. Dieses ist dadurch zunichte gemacht worden, daß durch die Führung derjenigen Mächte, die wir die regulären Hierarchien nennen, die Phantasie der Griechen und die Beeinflussung des sozialen Lebens durch Phantasie in die Freude am Irdischen umgewandelt worden ist, daß die Freude am Irdisch-Sinnlichen aufgenommen worden ist, daß der Grieche nicht bloß in der phantasievollen Imaginationswelt leben wollte, um allmählich die Seele dem Erdendasein zu entfremden, sondern sogar bis zu der Stimmung kam, die ausgedrückt wird in dem berühmten, von mir schon öfter angeführten Satze: Lieber ein Bettler auf der Erde, als ein König im Reiche der Schatten. — Durch dieses freudevolle Erleben der Welt zwischen der Geburt und dem Tode sollte durch die regulären Mächte das Griechentum der Gefahr entrissen werden, welche die luziferischen Mächte mit ihm vorhatten: die Seelen fortzuführen, so daß auf der Erde die Leiber, die noch geboren worden wären, ichlos über die Erde gegangen wären und die Seelen fortgewesen wären in einem besonderen Planeten für sich.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":396,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/171/1916-09-24/p005"},{"locus":"GA 171/1916-09-24/p006","passage_number":6,"text":"Dagegen hat Ahriman im Romanentum gewissermaßen Luzifer Hilfe leisten wollen, indem er das Römische Reich und seine Nachfolger so gestalten wollte, daß es ein großer irdischer Mechanismus nur geworden wäre für Ich-lose Menschenwesen. Dadurch wäre er gewissermaßen für Luzifer eine Hilfe geworden. Während Luzifer den Saft der Zitrone, möchte ich sagen, herausziehen wollte für sich, war Ahriman damit beschäftigt im Römischen Reiche, die Zitrone auszupressen und sie dort zu einem mechanistischen Staatsorganismus zu machen. So arbeiten sich ja Ahriman und Luzifer in die Hände. Das war durchkreuzt worden dadurch, daß die Bevölkerung des römischen Reichs den Begriff des «Civis» ausbildete, den Begriff des römischen Bürgers ausbildete im eminentesten egoistischen Sinne, und der menschliche Egoismus kann sich nur entwickeln innerhalb des physischen Erdendaseins. Dadurch wurde Ahrimans Absicht durchkreuzt, die Menschen ichlos zu gestalten. Gerade was das Rauhe, Phantasielose an der römischen Kultur ist, das ist das, was die Absichten Ahrimans durch den Egoismus der römischen Politik und des römischen Rechtes durchkreuzt hat. So war die griechische Zeit und die römische Zeit für Luzifer und Ahriman eine große Enttäuschung. Sie hatten einmal wiederum ihre Absichten nicht erreicht. Das ist überhaupt das Schicksal Luzifers und Ahrimans, daß sie mit ihren Kräften in der Erdenevolution wirken und immer wieder und wiederum die größten Anstrengungen machen, um zurückzuhalten den weiteren Fortgang der Evolution und ein Reich für sich zu begründen, und immer wieder und wiederum Enttäuschung in dieser Beziehung erleben müssen. Ich habe schon gesagt, derjenige, der da glaubt: Warum sind Luzifer und Ahriman nicht so weit, daß sie nun endlich einsehen, daß ihre Bemühungen ohne Wert sind? - der beurteilt das Geistige nach dem Menschlichen. Luzifer und Ahriman haben eben eine andere Urteilskraft als die Menschen, und man kann nicht das vom menschlichen Standpunkte aus beurteilen, was man beobachtet in der geistigen Welt, sonst würde man sich sehr bald für viel gescheiter halten als ein Gott oder überhaupt als ein Wesen, das einer höheren hierarchischen Ordnung angehört; und Luzifer und Ahriman gehören auch, wie wir wissen, wenn sie auch retardierende Geister sind, zu einer höheren hierarchischen Ordnung als der Mensch. So erklärt es sich, daß sie immer wieder und wiederum enttäuscht werden, aber daß sie immer wieder und wiederum ihre Anstrengungen von neuem beginnen.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":370,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/171/1916-09-24/p006"}],"beads":[{"from":[4,5],"to":[5],"confidence":"medium"},{"from":[6],"to":[],"confidence":"medium"},{"from":[7,8],"to":[6],"confidence":"medium"}],"note":"Paired by the paragraph aligner; each language numbers its own paragraphs. 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