{"corpus":"steiner","locus":"GA 204/1921-04-16/p006","lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"text":"How alive the conceptions of the Greek gods had been among the Greeks, and how conceptually abstract the ideas were the Romans entertained of their gods! Actually, in the later period, what the Greeks possessed of ideas concerning the super-sensible world was already lifeless, although quite alive as such within itself. Yet, it was a lifeless element in comparison to the living conceptions of the super-sensible worlds present during the ancient Persian and Indian civilizations, which represented a living within these higher worlds. In those times, albeit with a purely instinctive human perception, people lived in communion with the super-sensible worlds just as mankind in the present communes with the sensory world. For human beings in the ancient Orient, the spiritual world was readily accessible. For them, the beings of the spiritual world were present just as other human beings, our fellowmen, live side by side with us. Out of this living, super-sensible world, the Greeks built up their system of concepts. In the ages before Aristotle, up to the fourth century B.C., Greek ideas were not abstract ideas gained through external sensory observation and then lifted up into abstraction. These Greek ideas still originated from the living, super-sensible world; they were born of a primeval power of vision. These living Greek ideas still imbued a person with soul sustenance and warmth; insofar as he could share in them, they bestowed on him the necessary enthusiasm for his form of social order. Certainly, we must never forget that a large part of the Greek people was denied a share in this life of thought; this was the extensive world of the slaves. But the bearers of Greek culture certainly participated in a realm of ideas that was basically a downpouring of super-sensible, spiritual powers into the world of the earthly sphere.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"title":"Lecture V","site_heading":"The Holy Grail Mystery and Europe's Materialistic Turn","site_heading_note":"A heading the site wrote for this unit from a summary of it; not in the edition, and not the words of Rudolf Steiner or of the translator. Cite the unit by its title and locus, never by this heading, and do not quote it.","date":"1921-04-16","location":null,"word_count":301,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/204/1921-04-16/p006","alignment_confidence":"high","alignment_reason":"beads:length","two_voice_volume":false,"translation_credit":{"scope":"unit","status":"established","translator":"Maria St. Goar","identified_edition":"AP1987","book_title":"Materialism and the Task of Anthroposophy","publisher":"Anthroposophic Press","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA204/English/AP1987/19210416m01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"edition_coverage":{"de":["original"],"en":["English"]},"available_versions":[{"lang":"de","edition":"original","edition_basis":null,"is_original":true,"is_default_edition":true,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/204/1921-04-16/p006"},{"lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/204/1921-04-16/p006","paragraph_aligned":true}],"record":{"record_type":"unknown","scope":"volume","note":"How this text was taken down (shorthand transcript, listeners' notes or manuscript) is not on record here. Unknown is not an assurance of a stenogram: check the edition's own notes before resting an argument on one word.","evidence":null,"evidence_translation":null,"evidence_source":null},"paired_german":{"status":"paired","german":[{"locus":"GA 204/1921-04-16/p006","passage_number":6,"text":"Wie lebendig sind doch die Vorstellungen über die griechischen Götter bei den Griechen gewesen, und wie abstrakt begrifflich sind die Vorstellungen, die sich die Römer von ihren Göttern gemacht haben. Im Grunde genommen war in der späteren Zeit dasjenige, was die Griechen an Ideen hatten über die übersinnliche Welt,schon ein Unlebendiges, obwohl es in sich sehr lebendig war, aber verhältnismäßig ein Unlebendiges gegenüber den lebendigen Vorstellungen der übersinnlichen Welten, die darstellten ein Darinnenleben in diesen übersinnlichen Welten, wie sie in der älteren persischen Zivilisationsform vorhanden waren oder in der älteren indischen Zivilisationsform. Da lebte man in den übersinnlichen Welten, wenn auch dutch ein instinktives menschliches Erkennen, da lebte man aber doch mit diesen übersinnlichen Welten so, wie in der Gegenwatt eine spätere Menschheit mit der sinnlichen Welt lebt. Für den alten Orientalen war die geistige Welt durchaus etwas Erschlossenes. Für den alten Orient war die geistige Welt etwas, was für den Menschen so da war in bezug auf ihre Wesenheiten, wie für den späteren Menschen, nun, sagen wir, die anderen Menschen sind, die als seine Nebenmenschen neben ihm da sind, und der Grieche hatte aus dieser lebendigen übersinnlichen Welt heraus sein Begriffssystem gebildet. Die griechischen Ideen waren bis auf Aristoteles herunter im 4. Jahrhundert der vorchristlichen Zeit nicht solche abstrakte Ideen, die an der äußeren sinnlichen Beobachtung gewonnen und dann hinaufabstrahiert waren, diese griechischen Ideen waren noch herausgeboren aus der lebendigen übersinnlichen Welt, aus einer uralten Anschauung. Diese lebendigen griechischen Ideen durchseelten, durchwärmten noch den Menschen, gaben ihm noch den nötigen Enthusiasmus zu seiner Art des sozialen Lebens, insofern er an diesen Ideen teilnehmen konnte. Gewiß, man darf niemals vergessen, daß ein großer Teil des griechischen Volkes nicht teilnehmen durfte; es war das die weitausgebreitete Sklavenwelt. Aber diejenigen Menschen, welche die Träger der griechischen Kultur waren, die waren eben durchaus in einer Ideenwelt, die im Grunde genommen ein Herunterstrahlen übersinnlich-geistiger Mächte in die Welt des Irdischen war.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":317,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/204/1921-04-16/p006"}],"english":["GA 204/1921-04-16/p006"],"method":"length","confidence":"high","correspondence":"established","length_check":{"de_words":317,"en_words":301,"ratio":0.95,"partial":false},"pairing_state":"proposed","verified":false},"witness_completeness":{"ratio":1.11,"band":"comparable","note":null,"word_count":5250,"original_word_count":4746,"may_be_abridged":false},"witness_quality":{"translator":{"scope":"unit","status":"recorded","translator":"Maria St. Goar","identified_edition":"AP1987","book_title":"Materialism and the Task of Anthroposophy","publisher":"Anthroposophic Press","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA204/English/AP1987/19210416m01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 204/1921-04-16/p006"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"high","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. 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