{"corpus":"steiner","locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p013-p014","extent":"range","passage_number":13,"through":14,"paragraph_count":2,"first_locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p013","last_locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p014","lang":"en","edition":"English","edition_basis":null,"is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"title":"Lecture IV","date":"1924-06-10","location":null,"alignment_confidence":"medium","alignment_reason":"beads:length","two_voice_volume":false,"translation_credit":{"scope":"unit","status":"established","translator":"D. S. Osmond","identified_edition":"RSP1973","book_title":"Karmic Relationships: VII","publisher":"Rudolf Steiner Press","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA239/English/RSP1973/19240610a01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"edition_coverage":{"de":["original"],"en":["English"]},"record":{"record_type":"unknown","scope":"volume","note":"How this text was taken down (shorthand transcript, listeners' notes or manuscript) is not on record here. Unknown is not an assurance of a stenogram: check the edition's own notes before resting an argument on one word.","evidence":null,"evidence_translation":null,"evidence_source":null},"witness_completeness":{"ratio":1.0,"band":"comparable","note":null,"word_count":4615,"original_word_count":4612,"may_be_abridged":false},"site_heading":"Saturn Sphere's Role in Shaping Human Karma","site_heading_note":"A heading the site wrote for this unit from a summary of it; not in the edition, and not the words of Rudolf Steiner or of the translator. Cite the unit by its title and locus, never by this heading, and do not quote it.","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/239/1924-06-10/p013-p014","json_url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/239/1924-06-10/p013-p014.json","lecture_url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/239/1924-06-10#p013","word_count":1057,"quote_safe":true,"passages":[{"passage_number":13,"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p013","text":"Saturn-karma—Saturn-karma above all—works in deep, very deep regions of the soul. I want now to direct your attention to an individuality who in an earlier incarnation was actually an Initiate. I speak very objectively in this case and it has cost me a good deal of effort to work through to the truth because I was never specially attracted by this individuality in his new incarnation, nor am I to-day. But it is a matter of establishing objective facts and although effort is necessary, the truth is that one can discern with greater prospects of exactitude the karma of individuals to whom one is not drawn by personal sympathy and the like. And so I am going to speak to you about an individuality who in an earlier earthly life was an Initiate in Mysteries which were of very great moment in the evolution of humanity. This individuality was an Initiate in Irish Mysteries, the Mysteries of Hibernia, to which I have referred in one of the Mystery Plays. There were many experiences to be undergone before a man was led onwards through Initiation to wisdom in the form in which it was presented to him in these Irish Mysteries. The aspirant for Initiation had first to experience every kind of doubt that can arise in the human soul concerning the great truths of existence. The pupil was actually taught to doubt, to be utterly sceptical of everything, especially of the highest truths. And only when he had undergone all the suffering, the sense of tragedy, dejection and inner despair which accompany such doubt, only then was he guided to a full comprehension of truth, first of all as an Imaginative, pictorial experience and then as an experience of spiritual reality. Thus everyone who attained Initiation in the Hibernian Mysteries had learned not only to believe in the truth but also *not* to believe in it. Only so could his fidelity to truth prove itself a potent, unshakable force in life. Another feeling too was awakened in those who sought the Initiation-wisdom of Hibernia. It was the feeling that all existence may be as earthly existence: illusory, unreal. The pupils were brought to a point where they not only doubted truth but where they experienced the nothingness, the non-reality in human existence. And then, in order that the pupil might experience the etheric forces in their constant transformations and the physical forces which though involved in destruction are ever and again restored by the Spiritual, in order that when the right state of soul had been induced he might experience in a real imagination the destructive and upbuilding forces implicit in all life, he was led before two mighty pillar-statues. He was exhorted to press into one of the statues; this caused an indentation but because the substance of this statue was elastic throughout the form was ever and again restored and the statue seemed as though it were alive. And because the impression made by the actual touch was received by the pupil in a mood of reverence and solemnity, he became aware, inwardly aware, of the essential nature of the Living. The other statue was so constructed that pressure left an indentation which defaced the form and it was not until the following day, when the pupil was again led before this statue, that the deformation was repaired. The inner constitution of the Physical and the Etheric—something therefore of the truth revealed to self-observation—was presented in this way to the pupils. Then they were taken before other images and were thus led on to an even fuller understanding. The experience of spiritual reality was strong and intense in the pupils and Initiates of Hibernia. Indeed at certain stages of Initiation they no longer paid much heed to outer, physical reality, so intensely conscious were they of spiritual reality. It is actually the case that while the Mystery of Golgotha was taking place in physical reality over in Asia, the Hibernian priesthood so conducted the ceremonies that at the very time when the Mystery of Golgotha was fulfilled in outer, physical reality in Palestine, it was enacted in the form of a sacred rite in a Mystery Centre of Hibernia. Thus a physical fact taking place in a different region of the Earth was experienced in distant Hibernia as a *spiritual* fact. This will show you to what depths men were led in those Hibernian Mysteries.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":737,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/239/1924-06-10/p013","german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1924-06-10","de_passages":[{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p017","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p017"},{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p018","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p018"},{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p019","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p019"}],"bead_confidence":"medium","pairing_state":"verified","verified":true,"evidence":["length","reader"],"reader_german":["GA 239/1924-06-10/p017","GA 239/1924-06-10/p018","GA 239/1924-06-10/p019"],"length_check":{"de_words":765,"en_words":737,"ratio":0.96,"partial":false},"correspondence":"established","note":"English passage numbering is edition-relative, so the same number need not name the same paragraph in the German. 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Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 239/1924-06-10/p017","GA 239/1924-06-10/p018","GA 239/1924-06-10/p019"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"medium","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. See witness_completeness for how much of the original this witness holds."}},{"passage_number":14,"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p014","text":"There is an individuality who in very early times had attained a certain degree of Initiation in the Hibernian Mysteries and then, later on, passed through a female incarnation—but the influence of the Hibernian incarnation worked deeply, very deeply upon the soul. Then, in a life between death and a new birth, this individuality lived through experiences arising when karma is wrought out in the Saturn sphere. The whole significance of what the soul had acquired in an Hibernian Initiation—not at the highest but at a certain stage—was seen in retrospect, in a perspective widening out into a vista of great cosmic happenings. The import of the knowledge which it was possible to acquire in Hibernia was seen in its relation to the whole past evolution of man. In a majestic vision of cosmic evolution it was revealed how human longings and strivings through thousands of years had brought this Hibernia into being. But the modern age held in store for this individuality a body and a kind of education by which the most significant elements were obscured—yet for all that came to a certain expression in keeping with the civilisation of the nineteenth century. In this case too, what had been retained of the great cosmic retrospect was transformed when the soul came down into a physical body and underwent a kind of education neither of which in truth were suited to experiences lived through in an Hibernian Initiation and wrought out in the Saturn sphere. When the soul descended, this was all transformed into ideals reaching out to the future. But because the body was that of a Frenchman of the nineteenth century and therefore altogether different from the remarkable bodies of the old Irish Initiates, a very great deal receded into the background, transforming itself into sublime but fantastic pictures which, however have a certain power, a certain grandeur about them. This individuality reincarnated as *Victor Hugo*.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":320,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/en/ga/239/1924-06-10/p014","german_anchor":{"de_prefix":"1924-06-10","de_passages":[{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p020","url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p020"}],"bead_confidence":"medium","pairing_state":"proposed","verified":false,"length_check":{"de_words":305,"en_words":320,"ratio":1.05,"partial":false},"correspondence":"established","note":"English passage numbering is edition-relative, so the same number need not name the same paragraph in the German. The German original passage(s) above are the edition-invariant anchor — fetch them (lang='de') to verify wording before quoting across editions."},"witness_quality":{"translator":{"scope":"unit","status":"recorded","translator":"D. S. Osmond","identified_edition":"RSP1973","book_title":"Karmic Relationships: VII","publisher":"Rudolf Steiner Press","publisher_inferred":true,"match_score":1.0,"source_url":"https://www.rsarchive.org/Lectures/GA239/English/RSP1973/19240610a01.html","evidence":"lecture_page_line","publisher_note":"The publisher is inferred from the edition code in this lecture's source URL, not stated by the source page. The translator IS verified for this lecture: its own source names the translator (evidence: the lecture's page, rsarchive's lecture list, or the cover of the book it was published in), and that page's text was matched against this unit (see match_score and source_url). Cite the translator with confidence; attribute the publisher only as probable."},"entity_parity":{"status":"ok","checked_against":["GA 239/1924-06-10/p020"],"missing_from_translation":[],"present_only_in_translation":[],"bead_confidence":"medium","note":"Every load-bearing name in the German counterpart appears in this English passage. That is a check on NAMES only: a translation can keep every name and still reverse who acts on whom, change a number, or soften a claim. Read the German for anything you intend to rest an argument on."},"note":"quote_safe certifies the bytes of this text. This block is about the translation as a WITNESS: who made it, and whether it carries the same names as the original. See witness_completeness for how much of the original this witness holds."}}],"witnesses":[{"lang":"de","edition":"original","is_original":true,"is_default_edition":true,"first_passage":1,"last_passage":21,"passage_count":21,"word_count":4612},{"lang":"en","edition":"English","is_original":false,"is_default_edition":true,"first_passage":1,"last_passage":15,"passage_count":15,"word_count":4615,"completeness":{"ratio":1.0,"band":"comparable","note":null}}],"aligned_witness":{"status":"aligned","lang":"de","edition":"original","confidence":"medium","passages":[{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p017","passage_number":17,"text":"Nun, sehen Sie, tiefgründig wirkt ganz besonders Saturnkarma. Da möchte ich den Blick auf eine Individualität lenken, die nun wirklich in einer früheren Inkarnation ein Eingeweihter war. Ich spreche in diesem Falle wirklich objektiv, und es hat mir einige Mühe gekostet, die Wahrheit, die ich nun vorzutragen habe, herauszuarbeiten, weil mir die Individualität eigentlich in ihrer neuen Verkörperung gar nicht sympathisch war, bis heute nicht sympathisch ist. Es handelt sich ja eben um die Feststellung objektiver Tatsachen, und man kann eigentlich, trotzdem es Mühe kostet, mit einer größeren Aussicht auf Richtigkeit das Karma durchschauen der Persönlichkeiten, die einem nicht persönlich irgendwie durch Sympathie nahestanden. Da möchte ich Ihren Blick richten auf eine Individualität, die wirklich in einem vorigen Erdenleben ein Eingeweihter war, und zwar ein Eingeweihter in einer Mysterienart, die etwas Großes, Gewaltiges in der Entwickelungsgeschichte der Menschheit war, ein Eingeweihter in irischen Mysterien, in den Mysterien von Hybernia, auf die ich in meinem Mysteriendrama hingedeutet habe. In diesen Mysterien mußte vieles durchgemacht werden, ehe man hinauf-initiiert wurde zu derjenigen Gestalt der Weistümer, die man gerade in diesen irischen Mysterien empfangen sollte. Da mußte derjenige, der initiiert werden wollte, zunächst erleben einerseits alles dasjenige, was sich an Zweifeln gegenüber den großen Wahrheiten in der menschlichen Seele ablagern kann; der Schüler wurde geradezu erzogen dazu, an allem so stark zweifeln zu können, als man irgendwie zweifeln kann, zweifeln zu können gerade an den höchsten Wahrheiten. Und erst, wenn man in seiner Seele alles das durchgemacht hatte an Schmerzen, an innerer Tragik, an Niedergedrücktheit, ich möchte sagen an innerlichem Zerpreßtsein, alles was man erleben kann im Zweifeln an den höchsten Wahrheiten, dann wurde man, zuerst bildhaft imaginativ und dann in geistiger Realität, zu dem wirklichen Erfassen der Wahrheit hingeführt. So daß ein jeder, der in hybernische Mysterien eingeweiht war, nicht nur gelernt hatte, an die Wahrheit zu glauben, sondern auch, an die Wahrheit nicht zu glauben. Dadurch erst konnte sich das Unerschütterliche seines Festhaltens an der Wahrheit lebenskräftig erweisen.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":327,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p017"},{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p018","passage_number":18,"text":"Noch ein anderes Gefühl wurde wachgerufen bei denjenigen, die zu suchen hatten die Initiationsweisheit Hybernias. Sie wurden zu der Empfindung gebracht, daß eigentlich alles Dasein so sein könnte wie das Erdendasein: eine Illusion, kein wirkliches Dasein. Nicht nur zu zweifeln an der Wahrheit, sondern zuempfinden das Nichts im menschlichen Dasein, das Nichtsein im menschlichen Dasein, dazu wurde der Mensch gebracht. Und dann wurde er gegenüber den sich immer neu gestaltenden ätherischen Mächten und gegenüber den physischen Mächten, die in einer Zerstörung begriffen sind, aber vom Geistigen, von geistiger Seite her immer neu gestaltet werden, gegenüber all dem, was das Leben durchzieht an zerstörenden und wieder aufbauenden Kräften, nachdem sein Gemüt in die richtige Stimmung versetzt war, um ganz zur Imagination in dieser Sache zu kommen, vor zwei mächtige, gewaltige Bildsäulen geführt. Und er wurde dazu veranlaßt, die eine Bildsäule zu drücken: immer wieder stellte sich die Bildsäule her, da diese Bildsäule so gestaltet war, daß sie ganz elastisch war; immer stellte sich dasjenige, was er hineingedrückt hatte, wiederum her, Die Bildsäule behielt immer wieder ihre Form, aber die Bildsäule erschien ihm wie lebendig. Und er wurde, weil feierliche Stimmung es war, in die er zuerst getaucht war bei diesem unmittelbaren Eindruck, den er durch das Berühren erfahren hatte, auf die Eigenheit des Lebendigen hingewiesen. Die andere Bildsäule war so konstruiert, daß, wenn man auf sie drücken wollte, das wieder drinnen blieb, wodurch sie deformiert wurde, Erst wenn man am nächsten Tage wiederum vor sie hingeführt wurde, war sie ausgebessert. Die innere Konstitution des Physischen und des Ätherischen, also etwas von der Wahrheit der Selbstanschauung, zog vor die Schüler hin.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":269,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p018"},{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p019","passage_number":19,"text":"Das war die erste Stufe. Dann wurden sie vor andere Bilder geführt, immer mehr hineingeführt in das tatkräftige Begreifen der inneren Konstitution. Diese Schüler Hybernias umfaßten in der Tat in ihrer Seelenkonstitution stark dasjenige, was geistige Wirklichkeit heißt. Die äußere physische Wirklichkeit achteten sie, wenn sie gewisse Grade der Initiation erreicht hatten, nicht mehr sehr, aber in der geistigen Wirklichkeit wußten die hybernischen Eingeweihten zu leben. War es doch in einer Weihestätte Hybernias so, daß — während in der physischen Welt drüben in Asien das Mysterium von Golgatha in unserer physischen Wirklichkeit sich abspielte - die Hohepriesterschaft Hybernias die Kulthandlungen dahin zuspitzte, daß in derselben Zeit, in der in Palästina vor sich ging in äußerer physischer Realität das Mysterium von Golgatha, drüben in der Weihestätte Irlands das Mysterium von Golgatha als Kulthandlung gleichzeitig gefeiert wurde. Das heißt, es wurde in Hybernia über die Erde herüber eine physische Tatsache als geistige an einem anderen Erdenorte erlebt. Das soll Ihnen eben andeuten, zu welcher Tiefe gerade diese hybernischen Mysterien eigentlich führten.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":169,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p019"},{"locus":"GA 239/1924-06-10/p020","passage_number":20,"text":"Nun gibt es eine Individualität, die bis zu einem gewissen Grade in diese hybernischen Mysterien eingeweiht war in einer sehr frühen Zeit und dann später eine weibliche Inkarnation durchmachte; aber die eine Inkarnation Hybernias wirkte tief, tief auf die Seele. Dann machte diese Individualität in einem Leben zwischen Tod und neuer Geburt dasjenige durch, was man erlebt, wenn man durch eine Saturnverarbeitung des Karma geht. Da wurde die ganze Bedeutung der Seelenerrungenschaften, die erlangt werden konnten in einer hybernischen Initiation — nicht in der höchsten, aber in einer Initiation doch bis zu einem gewissen Grade -, rückwärts geschaut in einer nach dem universellen Geschehen gehenden Perspektive. Die ganze Bedeutung desjenigen, was man in Hybernia lernen konnte, wurde gesehen in seiner Stellung gegenüber dem ganzen vergangenen Wirken der Menschenwesenheit. Wie sich dieses Hybernia aus menschlichen Sehnsuchten von Jahrhunderten, von Jahrtausenden allmählich entwickelt hat, wurde da erarbeitet in einer großartigen kosmischen Rückschau. Aber es stand gerade dieser Individualität bevor, als die neuere Zeit heranrückte, eben einen solchen Menschenleib zu haben und eine solche Menschenerziehung, in der sich das Wichtigste davon verbirgt, und doch wiederum in Gemäßheit eben der Zivilisation des neunzehnten Jahrhunderts auslebte. Und wiederum war es so, daß sich dasjenige, was in der Rückschau sich nun die Seele hereingebracht hat beim Heruntersteigen in einen wahrhaftig nicht sehr geeigneten physischen Leib, zu einer für dasjenige, was in irischer Initiation durchgemacht und vom Saturn bearbeitet worden war, gar nicht geeigneten Erziehung, verwandelte in Ideale, die in die Zukunft hereinwirkten. Aber weil es untertauchen mußte in einen Körper, der nicht so war wie die ganz merkwürdigen Körper der alten irischen Eingeweihten, sondern eben wie der Körper eines Franzosen des neunzehnten Jahrhunderts, so trat da vieles zurück, verwandelte sich jedoch in schwungvolle, aber phantastische Bilder, die doch wieder etwas Eindringliches, Großartiges haben. Diese Individualität wurde dann die Persönlichkeit Victor Hugos.","text_trust":"verbatim","quote_safe":true,"word_count":305,"url":"https://anthroposophy.ai/v1/steiner/de/ga/239/1924-06-10/p020"}],"beads":[{"from":[13],"to":[17,18,19],"confidence":"medium","pairing_state":"verified"},{"from":[14],"to":[20],"confidence":"medium","pairing_state":"proposed"}],"note":"Paired by the paragraph aligner; each language numbers its own paragraphs. A bead at either end of the span can carry text beyond it (the `from` numbers show what each bead covers)."}}